A Richer Piedmont: Stefano Gagliardo Talks about Barolo, Langhe, Roero, and More

Poderi Gianni Gagliardo

by Andrew Chalk

Stefano Gagliardo is part of the sixth generation that is running Poderi Gianni Gagliardo in Italy’s Piedmont region. He came to town recently and presented the wines that are available in the US market. 

Some Background

The estate was founded in 1847 by the Colla family and known as the Colla family estate, or Paulo Colla Winery. It started producing Barolo wines in 1961 from vineyards in La Morra under a fourth generation member also named Paolo Colla. In 1973 Gianni Gagliardo, who had married into the Colla family, produced his first wine, an Arneis, in Roero. In 1981 Paulo passed away and Gianni assumed the winemaker role, changing the name of the winery to the current one in 1986. 

Gianni’s sons Stefano, Alberto, and Paulo now run the estate. Expansion added additional vineyards in Barolo which are now up to 8 crus in 5 villages, spanning approximately 26 acres in Langhe and 23 acres in Roero. Then 2017 saw a significant expansion as the Gagliardo family purchased Tenuta Garretto in Agliamo Terme in the Nizza DOCG known as the village of Barbera. This appellation has only 25 acres of vineyards, fifteen of which are owned by Garetto. As seen in the tasting below, Gagliardo also produces the little known white varietal Timorasso from this area. 

Stefano, his father, and two brothers

A Conversation with Stefano Gagliardo

SG: So we're just, you know, just saying a little bit about what we are going to have today.

Two wineries. Gianni Gagliardo is, of course, our heritage. It's where we started to make Barolo in 1961. You may know but at that time it was a wine for gifts for Embassies. It was still a wine that belonged to the old memories of the Savoy family and the Sardinia kingdom. So still, we had those kinds of memories. So it was, but it was the dusty bottle on the shelf, right? The Dolcetto was very much the bottle that was daily opened at home, also in restaurants in local trattorias. And so at that time, my grandfather, Paulo used to be a Dolcetto maker. So, and I think it's very significant for me that at that time, we decided to say, okay, you know what? All right, but I'm going to make Barolo. Because he liked it very much. He was passionate about Barono.

So this is basically the reason we are making wine. Because it is his decision to enter Barolo in the United States again.

Tenuta Garetto

Besides Gagliardo, we have Tenuta Garetto  here, which is a winery which was founded in 1935 and which we had the opportunity to purchase in 2017. Alexander Garreto used to be my wine making schoolmate, so I grew up a little bit tasting these wines alongside my wines. And I had very good memories of the wines there, and also I remember the reputation of the estate was very good.

Our schoolmates were laughing at him saying, hey, with those kinds of wines, you don't need to be so good to make a good wine. So, you know, at some point when we had this opportunity, we couldn't let this go.

And so we included the Tenuta Garetto, which still is a completely separate winery, independent, where we have vineyards crushing facility, bottling, warehousing, everything completely independently.

Even if it's just half an hour away from Gagliardo. The Tenuta Garetto is, to me, defined by a couple of things. A special spot, which is in the village of Agliano Terme, which I like to compare this as a sera lunga in the Barolo area. Meaning that is a place with strong character and bold wines, with a lot of savory flavors and salinity. And so the place is very much the key point of this project. But also old vines. The old vines give, of course, what we all know about, right?

In terms of elegance, depth, complexity into the wines. So we immediately started with the Barbera grape, which is the main grape of the estate. But then we did develop this into something else, including some Timorasso, where we. planted 5 ha in the Colli Tortonesi, which is about one hour away from the Nizza appellation. 

So today, here I am going to show two wines. One is the Barbera D’Asti. One is Colli Tortonesi. 

Tenuta Garetto 2022 Barbera D’Asti Superiore DOCG

You have to picture that Barbera D’Asti is an appellation which is fairly big compared to the average appellation because it covers 161 villages. But then there is one small area made of 18 villages, which is in the south of the city of Asti, where, since the 1500s, everybody knew that the standard quality was higher, and the typology of the wine was different. This is basically what became the Nizza appellation area. But of course, within the Nizza area, we are still able to do varietal wines. We can do Nizza, we can do Barbera D’Asti, exactly like in the Barolo area we can do Barolo and Langhe Nebbiolo. So we still have these options in the Nizza area. 

So the first one I'm showing is Barbara D’Asti from the Nizza area. Some people say, okay, it's not made in wood. So is it your young wine? I say, no, it's not a young wine. It's not aged in wood. But it goes in concrete for a long time. And I do late bottlings. For me, this is very important, but this is due to the origin of the grapes, the grapes of Agliano need time, but at the same time, I want purity. I want fruit. I want very much to integrate with food, and I want a very lively one. Because of that, we decided to stay in concrete for a long time.

And this is the vintage 2022, which nowadays, as of today, when we speak, we have Barolo 2022 on the market.

AC: So it's the current vintage. 

SG: This is the current vintage. 

AC: How long did it spend in concrete? 

SG: We spend in concrete a couple of years, about 24 months, and it's a very long time.

AC: And this is unlined concrete?

SG: This is the old style concrete from the seventies. So it's not, we don't have porosity, you know, like today. No. it's very much the neutral container. I think those kinds of old concrete tanks, which are also coated inside, they represented the most neutral container we can have, because there is no air exchange, but at the same time, there is no, they say, electrical exchange, no, no. Potential electrical potential. It's very neutral. Also electrical wise. So it's a very gentle and protective and reductive way to let the wine evolve.

AC: So, with concrete, how much exchange with the air is there through the concrete?

SG: Almost nothing. The air we have. Exchange is something which it's even very difficult to calculate because it belongs to the top closure and evolves because the material itself is completely sealing, like stainless steel.

AC: That's what I was going to say. There's kind of an allure currently about aging in concrete, but if it's as impermeable as stainless it's the same.

SG: The only thing that is the main difference is the electrical potential. That is completely different because, of course,stainless is a conductor. It's a very good conductor and concrete is not. No, so that's the main thing, okay. But we have electrical potentials into the aging process. Potential in the aging process has an influence. Because what happens in the process of evolution is a chemical path you know about polymerization, e.g. about stabilization, tartaric stabilization. Where there are salts generated by acid and potassium, you know, and all those things, if they are submitted to an electric potential they happen in a very different way, right? So I found, we found, that a very neutral container helps the wine very much to evolve in a way which is lower, very much natural and not influenced by external elements.

AC: How large are your concrete tanks? 

SG: We inherit these tanks with the winery. And they belong to the seventies. But what we have done, we restored them, of course, because all of the valves, all of the things are now in stainless steel, of course, which is the best material. You know, in terms of being clean and efficient. And also, we redid the coating inside all of them. So we kept the body of the casks. But we made them contemporary. 

AC: Thanks for clarifying. Nowadays, one often hears of wineries using concrete in the United States, but it turns out that they are lined with a plastic called epoxy. And so really you're aging in epoxy, not in concrete.

On approaching this wine… Beautiful nose. Definitely fruit, lead. And it’s got a lovely roundness to it. It’s not what you might call an acidic type of jam. 

SG: Yes, red fruit absolutely. Barbera, to me, once it is properly ripe, can combine red fruits to black fruits as well. And it normally is a very lively, lively flavor now, which is very, kind of fleshy, and at the same time when you have the right amount of body, and character, and density and texture, that kind of flavor doesn't turn out to be a lean wine, you know, but it tends to be just a fresh, refreshing, and always kind of calling for the next sip. And I think in the Tenuta Garretto, we also have something which is the salinity, which is normally, I call it, a support. I know it's a saver of wine, which is very much the tastingness of the wine. Which is something which doesn't belong to any maker’s technique, of course. It's very much about the site. So that's why I always start by the site on the wines, which makes the main difference, the main character. 

AC: This also has some nice, grippy tannins still. Oh, and this is going to age for a little bit.

SG: Definitely. Wines from Nizza need time. And they also give time to the consumer. And so as proof, we are tasting a 22. So there are some Barberas in Italy now that are 2025. But I think it's very important to give time to the wines.

AC: Traditionally, as I understand it, Barbera was considered the cash crop of Piedmont. 

SG: It was, because of a couple of reasons. It was a bit more resistant compared to other grapes, and to, of course, the fungus and all the diseases, plant diseases. And of course, it could be fairly productive, depending on how you grow that. So of course it was very important for farmers to have some, to have some, to have enough crop, right? 

AC: And I think of it as having improved. It could be as though it's aspiring to be on the same part of the table as the top tier red wines. Now, wine making has improved so much.

SG: I think it's a very transversal wine to consumers, because we, in Piedmont, have, I think, very fine wines, but many of them, they are driven, they have tannins as well. This is something that is not for everybody. Tannins is something that you may eventually reach in your wine path. Once you start to deal, understand, appreciate, read. Tannins, you are already on a certain level of knowledge of wines, you know. But of course, wine is not just for wine aficionados or for wine specialists. Wine is for everyone. No? So it's very important to us to have wines that are more inclusive. You know, and I think Barbera is one of them, is very much the food wine by essence.

And it also helps new worldwide consumers to start understanding a different flavor. It brings them into Europe and brings them into Italy. And little by little, you know, hopefully, some of them will get into the top wines of Piedmont.

AC: If all Barberas were like this, I think it would be very widely accepted. That's a very good one. Thank you. Good start. 

But now we go from red to white, and a white grape I know nothing about.

Tenuta Garetto 2022 ‘Derthona’ Timorasso, Colli Totonesi DOC.

SG: This is a grape which is very important, I think, and it will be very important for the future of Piedmont. It is a completely indigenous grape. There is no known familiarity with other grapes. It's called the Timorasso, and it's grown and still today, raised in the southeast of the region of Piedmont in a little corner between Piedmont, Lombardy and Liguria. It's called the Colli Tortonesi (the Tortona Hills). And this grape has a nickname that tells a lot about it. It's called the Barolo Bianco. Why this? Because there is something similar with the Barolo, which is especially connected with time, how this wine evolves over time.

Timorasso is a wine that can be very enjoyable in the youth. But then you can expect 10, 12, 15, 20, 25 years of aging on a white, which is absolutely unusual. It's a grape that involves, also includes, also the Riesling molecule in the flavor profile, which you can get in the youth. But then it goes into a completely different direction over time, going into the more waxy character, you know, that is more similar to some Savagnin from the Jura, where you go into that kind of edge of oxidation, which you say, maybe it's time to drink it, but it will stay like that forever. Okay, you know. So Timorasso, to me, is part of the present of the Piedmont, but it will be very much something important for the future of top wines of Italy in white, because I think there is a space for Italian wines to go also in the right pages of the wine lists.

AC: You're venturing into whites, with this And you introduce the local variant of Vermentino, Favorita. And I thought, well, now that's interesting when you are in the area where you make what they call the king of Italian wines, Barolo, but your venture is actually into a white grape.

SG: Yes, because the Piedmont is a complex area now, which includes, as well, very high potential for some whites. First of all, in the Barolo area itself, we do Barolo Three kilometres away, which is already outside of the Barolo area, we have some sandy soils, which are thermal. So in that specific area of Roero, there is a natural predisposition to make whites.

Our land is a land of complexity, you know, where we have different things. Of course, it's kind of normal that at some point we need to simplify the message, you know. And so people think, man, what's the best from out of there? But all okay, that's a place. Or not. But in fact, we have also, I think, in the region, region wise, very good whites. If we talk regional, for example, alongside that, Timorasso, we have Gavi, you know, we have then Arneis in the Roero. We have Alta Langhe in the sparklings. So there is a kind of bouquet of possibilities in the region. 

AC: Was it an urge to diversify that made you invest in these whites? Or was it because of climate change? Consumer demand? 

SG: Not really. I think we started by a principle. Which is very simple but crucial, and very important. Every grape has a best place, best spot, best soil to be planted. So this means that that's what we have to do to plant the best, the right grapes in the right place. Because this, if you take it on the way around, it means that any other thing is a compromise, is a plan B. So if we have land which is good for Timorasso we have to make Timorasso. If we have land for Barbera, we have to make Barbera and on and on. 

AC: And what kind of terroir does Timorasso like? 

SG: Timorasso in this specific plot is very fascinating. Black and green rock, which is giving a lot of drainage. And it's giving a lot of stony character, a lot of, you know, of silty character. And it's very peculiar, very different. This story. It's very fun because we are in a little village. Fraction of a village now called Zebidasi. And this soil was so unique that we started to search. And if you Google that, if you see on Wikipedia, there is a soil which is called Zebi Detail.

Which means that that soil takes the name from that little place, and that is the place as one vineyard, one abandoned church, and two abandoned homes, houses. And this is where we are. So the name of the soil is the name of that place. So it's amazing, you know, it's a small spot which is very, very unique.

AC: Got it. And I noticed in the nose, this is like, almost petrol qualities, like Riesling.

SG: Exactly. And in the youth, you do have that kind of element which accompanies, you know, all of the rest. Zero oak. This is stainless steel. But we use yeast, we keep the wines sur lees for a pretty long time, until August, about ten months. But I think what normally impresses people is the texture.

AC: So it's got a spritzy mouthfeel. Great acid. This will be great with so many foods.

SG: Well, Timorasso, I think I'm pretty sure it will be, it will be one of the protagonists of the future of Italian whites.

AC: In the US market, what do you see it competing with? 

SG: I don't see much competition. I see. I see a place now that Is in between. I guess, in between some crush, crucially, some big Riesling, and some Jura, depending on the age of the bottle. It's kind of standing on his own spot. 

AC: Its own taste. 

SG: Exactly. If I want to drink Riesling, I don't drink Timorasso, even when I drink right. If I want to drink a big Chard I don't drink Timorasso. Timorasso is Timorasso, which for me is a value.

AC: So basically, you have been making this, and you and your contemporaries have been making this a long time, and you're very experienced with it. It really just hasn't been projected into the US or other markets. 

SG: Actually, Timorasso is now in the booming moment. It's because we have many producers, many of my colleagues, that went there to make Timorasso. So now you start to wonder if your winery is going to Timorasso, and you start seeing Timorasso on the market right now. Finally, finally.

Poderi Gianni Gagliardo

Now we go into Gagliardo. It's different, I don't want to say different chapters. It's a different book, because it's different, completely different. You know, place state, think six generations? 

Gianni Gagliardo 2024 Roero Arneis DOCG

That's amazing. And this is more Roero Arneis, of which I like to say it's more Roero than Arneis, of course, because the varietal, of course, is very important. But I think to me, here we have this kind of soil influence, which is very strong, because we have a top soil which is very sandy, and there's pretty deep top soil, which doesn't have only an influence on how the roots gets the nutrients and the flavors into the wine, but also in terms of climate, because it warms up very much the air. About three, four feet outside of the soil. So it also has an impact on the physiology of the plant. So I think the texture, this kind of oily touch, which you find here, is more about the place, more about the site, and driven by the soil compared to the varietal. And I think this is, that's why I like to say, this is Roero. Then Arneis, okay. It's Arneis, but it's a place, yes, 

AC: It's got a lovely earthiness to it, and a fantastic body in the mouth. You know, there's a difference in weight between this and the Timorasso. 

SG: Definitely. And this is in terms of volume, body, in terms of dimension the wines. I like to see this as a food wine, which is very much the DNA of Italian wines, no? It is a seafood wine, an oyster wine. This is very important because we never have to lose, let's say, the goal, not the final essence of who we are. In Italy, in Italy, we make wine for food.

AC: I was thinking about that when we had the Barbera, and I wanted to say, it's sort of the Italian formula but the word formula sounds demeaning. It's like everyone is done the same way. 

SG: It's not that, it's more of a philosophy, like just say, it's more DNA. It's the way we always look at wine. You judge a wine. How will this go with food? Well, because if you go back in the tradition, in the roots, we had wine that was, sometimes, considered almost like a food, because in every table, every single table of Italy. Rich, poor people, farms, city country, not all the same. We had red wine and olive oil. Yes, that was the essentials, right? Yes, you know. So wine was part of the meal. It was impossible to make wine. Wine shouldn't be to celebrate wine. It had to be enjoyable and working well with the food. That was so still, we have kind of memories, you know, like that, if you like it or not. But there are roots. No, there are roots. 

Gianni Gagliardo 2020 Da Batiè,Langhe DOC

Now we're going to a wine which I define Langhe Nebbiolo as an appellation, but is exactly from the same soil. It's from the Roero soil. That sand I was describing on the Arneis is the same one. But this is the result, which we have on red on the Nebbiolo, because every plant, every variety, has a different reaction to the climate to the soil, right? So I always felt that this, wanted to have a little bit of this kind of energy now, also this kind of electricity, this kind of very, specific type of character, which I didn't want to compromise with wood. That's why I decided, in this case, to use stainless steel containers for a long time.

AC: And this wine is six years old, and this color is really instructive for students. We tell them that Nebbiolo has a brown tinge at a very early age. It doesn't mean it's as aged as other wines that  have that color. And this is a classic example. You've got essentially a wine that's still youthful. And again, it's got that brown tinge to it.

Classic Nebbiolo fruit.

SG: Salinity more than tannins, because in this case, the salinity that sand gives this kind of stony character.

AC: And it's a very cooked fruit. 

SG: Tell me.

AC: Nebulo is the basis for what I would call the two most famous wines from Italy. But it's also, when I go through the shelves, I find spanna, Langhe, I find other names that are, essentially incarnations or expressions. 

SG: Yes, Nebbiolo, yes. That is the proof. To me, it is a proof when there is beauty, when there is value in the grape, then this grape goes around, you know, over time and oversights, and it gets also local differences, local clones, local names, local different kinds of uses. Nebbiolo is an example, right? Because it's the same time. It's very connected with the Piedmont, because you cannot find them. I mean, Nebbiolo is about Piedmont, so you cannot export the grape very much because it's very tied with our climate and soil. 

AC: Just to interrupt you a second. That's another characteristic of it. It's one of the grapes that has not proven transportable. Basically, you've got Valtellina, you've got, obviously, Piedmont. And there's different expressions for it there. And then when it's been tried, e.g. in places where they put a lot of effort into trying other grapes, like California, it's been a wholesale failure. It doesn't transform into other areas. 

SG: I think Nebbiolo is one of the most terroir wines on Earth also because of that, because it's completely tied with the soil, with the climate, with the place, with this kind of protection we have by 280 degrees of mountain of slopes around us. And so it is a magic combination between one grape and one place. That's why, I mean, it is one of the most terroir-aware wines because Is not, let's say, the variety of a particular variety of wine which you export, and you, maybe you don't do, but all of but you do Nebbiolo variety of wines, not really. It's very demanding, and I think this is a plus. And also minus no, because the plus is that Nebbiolo is a lens of small differences. On soils and climate changes. And this is a plus because you can have variations by cru that are so unique.

Gianni Gagliardo 2020 Barolo DOCG

AC: With this first Barolo. I notice now that there's an incredible savoriness, earthiness. There's almost leather aromas coming through with older, and, you know, more prestigious ones, like Barolo to Barbaresco. 

SG: So this is Barolo 2020. This is the Barolo classico. So, it is very important for us. Because the reputation of a winery is made by a classico, it's not made by two bottles of super cru I mean, okay, we do that, but this is but all classicos is where people explore Gagliardo, or no, and they try Gagliardo. They try to read Gagliardo and see what we do, no. And if they like what we do, if they feel comfortable with it, they buy more. And then maybe at one time, they try our cru, yes. And this is very much our approach. So we put a lot of effort, stylistic effort in making this wine to represent Gagliardo. And this is a combination of eight plots out of five villages. So we include The Lazzarito, the Mosconi and some of the grapes are dedicated to this. So basically we're renowned to make more bottles of cru in order to have a very solid bottle of classico, and bottle of classico for us must be, I mean, first of all, it's La Morra driven. La Morra centred, you know, it's not 100 % La Morra, of course, as we said but La Morra represents a big chunk of the blend. And for me, this is very much about the elegance and places, the quality of the tannins. We do have much tannin here, but we want the tannins to be enjoyable, inclusive.

I understand that using the word inclusive with tannins may sound a little strange, but I think it's our challenge, you know, to make tannins that are inclusive. tannins that also my mother in law understands.

AC: Very complex. Maybe that reflects the fact that it's from several different parts. Very powerful. I feel like it's got some classic notes of Barollo, like the dried fruit. The leather, definitely some age on it. Secondary tertiary notes present. Is this the wine you would lead with in the restaurant market?

SG: Oh, a bit of everything. I mean, it's not really restaurants, but also retail. But to me, it's very important to try. You touch some, you say some words which are very fitting with our idea. We want to be complex but not complicated. It means vision, very important, and for me, very important is pleasure. Why make a wine if pleasure is not the center, pleasure must be the center word of every wine.  Wines that are attractive, pleasant. You want more. You want to drink. You want to drink a bottle. I think this is very much what we need to do with Gagliardo. 

AC: This wine draws me in. The way that it evolves in the mouth. 

SG: And also to be, try to be, contemporary. Contemporary, to me, is a very positive word, because contemporary, if you want to be properly contemporary you have to be very aware about your past. You have to know about where you're from. You have to know about today. You have to know about… You need to be mobile. It's almost like a Darwin. Darwin to be Darwin, to be contemporary, means that we need to always be actual. We need to be able to do the right thing at the right time. We need to say, we are not. We don't want to be lazy, and say, I just repeat what my grandfather did. That's a mistake. At the same time, we don't need to do any revolution. We just need to try to fine tune what's about all of today.

AC: Evolve.

SG: Evolve. Evolution is the key, is not?

AC: Let me ask you about aging. Are you aging this in large barrels or in barriques?

SG:,Large, large barrels, neutral, non-new, new never. Combination of different woods, 35hl casks. 

AC: Slavonian oak? 

SG: On the same body. On the same piece, we have the body, which is French and then we have the top which is Slavonian. 

AC: Okay, so you haven't gone totally over to the dark side, to use contemporary parlance. 

SG: No, no, no, no. 

AC: Because there's one of the debates in Barolo, I understand, has been between the traditionalists and those who've gone completely over to barriques. 

SG: I think that was a very important step for the Barolo history. But that is over. I think now. Now. Now it's the evolution. Now people want to deliver the character of the place. I think this is a sign of maturity. 

Gianni Gagliardo 2019 Barolo La Morra DOCG

So this is La Morra. La Morra. It's a village. Basically, you know, if you talk about Burgundy, you know, language is a village. So basically it's one village. It's two plots, two plots. La Morra is the one that gives a more fine ethereal, delicate, complex character. Okay. You normally don't have a bold palette in La Morra, but you have very much wine that is upfront. You have some herbal notes. Ripe herbal notes. It is a wine that Pinot drinkers like the most.

AC: You said it was very pleasant as well. That which you spoke about earlier about classico Barolo is true of this one. It's a very pleasant style. 

SG: This should be in our goal, in our everyday goal. It must be very much a common point for Gagliardo. As a Gagliardo type. Because I think today quality, you know, quality, concept of quality evolved. You know, you can find good wines everywhere. What's quality today? Quality, to me, is very related to style. So who are you? And the question, the question is, why? So, as a consumer, why should I buy Gagliardo? That might be a reason, very simple, very easy, you know. And for each winery which to me has the ambition to do Serie A so we need to be very clear in who we are and what we want to do and repeat and protect this time.

And it's also a question about respect to our customers, I think, very important. 

Gianni Gagliardo 2019 Barolo Monvigliero DOCG

So this is Monvigliero. Monvigliero is a single vineyard. It is one of the more sought after grapes today, because it's a small plot up in the north of the village of Verduno. Mild weather. Exposure is south, southwest. There's a river Tanaro, or just behind, little chalk, little chalk into the soil, which makes a difference versus other groups.

Again, this is a wine which is more like a material flower. Flower notes more complexity than La Morra. So we step up into a cru now, but at the same time it is not about body. It's not about body.  

AC: There's some ripe fruit, and then there's an earthiness, kind of also called forest floor.

SG: And this is 2019, also a very classic vintage. So it's a vintage that may be compared to the 20 and 21. And it's one more year to get to the point.

Gianni Gagliardo 2019 Barolo Lazzarito, Vigna Preve, DOCG

Then we go down in the south end of the Barolo area, which is near Serralunga. Lazzarito. We are one of the twelve producers who own vineyards in Lazzarito. It's the opposite. We go from far north to far south, and there is a geographical, you know, correspondence, we go from material, fine notes to multi dimensional strength and body.

AC: Vigna Preve in English, what is that?

SG: Basically it is like a plot. Like clos. 

AC: This is a really delicate combination of primary and the secondary and the tertiary notes, you know, the effects of aging. There's more emphasis on or dominance from the effects of aging.

SG: Then you have, in terms of palette you can feel when you have it in your mouth. You see, this is palette wine. And this is an aftertaste wine. You can savor this wine for 10 min.

AC: Finish long, long, long.

SG: Well, but here we are in the realm of the Grand Cuvée, Lazzarito.

AC: When you open these, how long do you give them for your palate? How long would you give them air to breathe? 

SG: I would take away this [indicates decanting down to the bottom of the shoulder] and put it back. Then, after 20 minutes, I would start having the wine.

AC: When I was at college I met some wine enthusiasts. They would bring Barolos that needed to be opened 12+ hours before drinking. These wines were 20 years old. 

SG: Those wines used to be dead. Dead. Also, because 20 year old wine is delicate. 

Gianni Gagliardo 2023 Fallegro, DOC

This is a vintage. This is wine which we have produced for 50 vintages. And is the exception to the rule. You know, Vermentino is great, which is very Mediterranean. But in each case, we have the exception of the rule. Thanks to, as you were mentioning before, the Savoy Sardinia Kingdom. No? The current province, Sardinia, we're all part of one state. And Vermentino was coming inland. So still today we have a little bit of Vermentino, which is the only example. And I think that this was the only example of continental climate Vermentino. So we have 95 % Vermentino, which we call Favorita in our area as a local name, and we have 5% percent of Riesling here, and we have 90 % of the wine, which is sur lees for six months, and we have 10% of the wine, which is belonging to the previous vintage in order to stay sur lees for 18 months. 

AC: What part of the meal do you see this going with?

SG: This is very open. You can start as an aperitivo. You can, it varies, to me. It's a provincial touch.  I'm going to drink a dominant seafood picnic. It depends. Okay, it's very easy to drink, but at the same time, if you age this wine for three, four, five, six, seven, eight years, ten years, really. Wow. Today, today 2016 is fantastic.

AC: Interesting wine. So, why the 5 % Riesling? 

SG: Because we found that it was just complete. A Vermentino is a great grape, but if you pay attention, in most cases, it's something else. You can have Vermentino when I understand, but it's like sometimes great grapes can do well together.

AC: Stefano Gagliardo, thank you very much for your time, and your insight into the many Piedmonts and your wines. 

Audio of Interview

Notes:

1. I have tried to preserve Stefano’s commentary as accurately as possible but sometimes editing was necessary to make the English translation clear;

2. Some of the automatic transcription was incorrect and the audio recording unclear (in particular, due to background noise);

3. Major Italian proper nouns (e.g. Piemonte) have been anglicized. Less well known ones left in th native tongue;